SQL Central Compatibility

[timcheshire]

What is the SQL Central compatibility between 17.0.4 and 17.0.10? Our current server running 17.0.4.2053 I have the 17.0.4.2053 Admin packaged by our IT department on my desktop.

Upgrading to a new server, I installed and tested against 17.0.4.2053, all was good. Upgraded the server to 17.0.10.6285 and I get this compatibility error when connecting from my desktop:

SQL central cannot connect to this database because it is running on a version 17.0.10 server. (You cannot connect to a database running on a version 17.0.10 server with version 17.0.4 SQL Anywhere plug-in.)

I thought SQL Anywhere was fairly agnostic when it comes to SQL Central.

It'll be a real pain to re-package the admin s/w. What are the compatibility rules for SQL Central?

[VolkerBarth]

According to the docs on "SAP SQL Anywhere 17.0 Components by Platforms":

Compatibility with existing SQL Central (formerly Sybase Central) software

Full support - The SQL Anywhere plug-in for SQL Central fully supports any database created by version 12 or later software running on a version 12 or later server. For example, version 12 databases running on version 12, 16 or 17 servers; version 16 databases running on version 16 or 17 database servers; and version 17 databases running on a version 17 database server.

Apparently your situation tells a different story.

[timcheshire]

Hi Volker. That's what I thought, V12-17 should be compatible. I have another server being built to replace one with 17.0.9 so will test against that one. Might take a few weeks depending on the server team. Tim

[Breck_Carter]

The "Compatibility" statement talks about backward compatibility. This situation may be more proof that 17.0.10 is really version 18.

[Breck_Carter]

> a few weeks depending on the server team

Who is Mordac? 🙂

[timcheshire]

🙂 Can't wait to ask them to re-package the 17.0.10 admin install.

[Breck_Carter]

> ask them

LOL 🙂

Seriously...

The Administration Tool Deployment on Windows describes what you have to include in your deployment of SQL Central, in the topic Step 2: Copy the Required Files:

The SQL Anywhere plug-in of SQL Central requires the personal server (dbeng17.exe and supporting files) and the following files.

In other words, if you want to deploy SQL Central to a client computer, you have to include the SQL Anywhere engine as well.

That makes SQL Central very different from any other client software... in fact, it defines SQL Central as a "server extension" rather than a client application.

[jack_schueler]

The referenced page has been updated to make it clear that within the major versions (17,16,12) there is an ordering to the major.minor.patch number such that the capabilities of version major.minor.patch are not necessarily supported in version major.minor.patch-1 or earlier.

[VolkerBarth]

Well, the Deployment Wizard can do it for you (and knows the requirements), just choose to include SQL Central within the according admin tools... - and you do not need to include the database options...

[timcheshire]

Launchpad file naming doesn't seem to help so I downloaded every EBF and checked the relevant "minor" versions. My tests show that SQL Central is compatible at the minor version level and will not work with a higher version. I've not tested backward compatibility. Below are my filename to ebf to minor version results:

Zip File    Desc    
PL  Build   EBF Minor Ver   File Size   Release Date    Change Date

SQLANYW170000P_72-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL72 Build 6315   
72  6315    ebf29945    10  496289 KB   2021-08-04  2021-08-04

SQLANYW170000P_71-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL71 Build 6285   
71  6285    ebf29868    10  460773 KB   2021-04-08  2021-04-08

SQLANYW170000P_67-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL67 Build 6230   
67  6230    ebf29754    10  458913 KB   2020-12-10  2020-12-10

SQLANYW170000P_61-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL61 Build 6175   
61  6175    ebf29619    10  461061 KB   2020-08-13  2020-08-13

SQLANYW170000P_59-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL59 Build 6160   
59  6160    ebf29570    10  461063 KB   2020-07-07  2020-07-07

SQLANYW170000P_56-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL56 Build 6089   
56  6089    ebf29439    10  459934 KB   2020-05-13  2020-05-13

SQLANYW170000P_55-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL55 Build 6057   
55  6057    ebf29363    10  460088 KB   2020-03-05  2020-03-05

SQLANYW170000P_53-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL53 Build 5963   
53  5963    ebf29252    10  460171 KB   2019-11-20  2019-11-20

SQLANYW170000P_52-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL52 Build 5923   
52  5923    ebf29204    10  425248 KB   2019-09-26  2019-09-26

SQLANYW170000P_51-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL51 Build 5913   
51  5913    ebf29180    10  425232 KB   2019-09-10  2019-09-10

SQLANYW170000P_49-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL49 Build 5866   
49  5866    ebf29121    10  423919 KB   2019-07-29  2019-07-29

SQLANYW170000P_46-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL46 Build 5855   
46  5855    ebf29087    10  423903 KB   2019-07-16  2019-07-16

SQLANYW170000P_44-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL44 Build 5820   
44  5820    ebf29057    10  421116 KB   2019-06-18  2019-06-18

SQLANYW170000P_43-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL43 Build 5771   
43  5771    ebf29004    10  421126 KB   2019-05-10  2019-05-10

SQLANYW170000P_42-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL42 Build 5750   
42  5750    ebf28995    10  423510 KB   2019-04-16  2019-04-16

SQLANYW170000P_41-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL41 Build 5745   
41  5745    ebf28932    10  423508 KB   2019-03-15  2019-03-15

SQLANYW170000P_39-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL39 Build 4935   
39  4935    ebf28847    9   335887 KB   2019-02-01  2019-02-01

SQLANYW170000P_38-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL38 Build 4913   
38  4913    ebf28744    9   335845 KB   2018-12-11  2018-12-11

SQLANYW170000P_36-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL36 Build 4897   
36  4897    ebf28714    9   335829 KB   2018-11-14  2018-11-14

SQLANYW170000P_35-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL35 Build 4882   
35  4882    ebf28676    9   335744 KB   2018-10-30  2018-10-30

SQLANYW170000P_34-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL34 Build 4857   
34  4857    ebf28641    9   335685 KB   2018-09-19  2018-09-19

SQLANYW170000P_31-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL31 Build 4838   
31  4838    ebf28537    9   335639 KB   2018-07-25  2018-07-25

SQLANYW170000P_30-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL30 Build 4803   
30  4803    ebf28310    9   335594 KB   2018-05-24  2018-05-24

SQLANYW170000P_29-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL29 Build 4793   
29  4793    ebf28181    9   340436 KB   2018-04-04  2018-04-04

SQLANYW170000P_28-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL28 Build 4148   
28  4148    ebf28082    8   319606 KB   2018-03-05  2018-03-05

SQLANYW170000P_27-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL27 Build 4103   
27  4103    ebf27841    8   319492 KB   2017-12-04  2017-12-04

SQLANYW170000P_26-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL26 Build 4087   
26  4087    ebf27737    8   319423 KB   2017-11-06  2017-11-06

SQLANYW170000P_25-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL25 Build 4075   
25  4075    ebf27703    8   319452 KB   2017-10-18  2017-10-18

SQLANYW170000P_23-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL23 Build 4043   
23  4043    ebf27590    8   319277 KB   2017-10-24  2017-10-24

SQLANYW170000P_22-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 PL22 Build 4003   
22  4003    ebf27545    8   319236 KB   2017-10-24  2017-10-24

SQLANYW170000P_20-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL20 Build 3399   
20  3399    ebf27104    7   318352 KB   2017-10-24  2017-10-24

SQLANYW170000P_19-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL19 Build 3382   
19  3382    ebf27049    7   318273 KB   2017-10-24  2017-10-24

SQLANYW170000P_18-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL18 Build 2806   
18  2806    ebf26958    6   318249 KB   2017-10-24  2017-10-24

SQLANYW170000P_17-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL17 Build 2806   
17  2806    ebf26931    6   318189 KB   2017-10-24  2017-10-24

SQLANYW170000P_16-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL16 Build 2757   
16  2757    ebf26691    6   318308 KB   2017-10-24  2017-10-24

SQLANYW170000P_15-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL15 Build 2182   
15  2182    ebf26627    4   317600 KB   2017-10-24  2017-10-24

SQLANYW170000P_13-71001031.ZIP  SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL13 Build 2129   
13  2129    ebf26497    4   316821 KB   2017-10-24  2017-10-24

SQLANYW170000P_12-71001031.ZIP  SQLAnywhere 17.0 SP0 PL12 Build 2100    
12  2100    ebf26419    4   316905 KB   2017-10-24  2017-10-24

SQLANYW170000P_8-71001031.ZIP   SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL8 Build 2053    
8   2053    ebf26182    4   312497 KB   2017-10-24  2017-10-24

SQLANYW170000P_5-71001031.ZIP   SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL5 Build 1359    
5   1359    ebf25842    0   306564 KB   2017-10-24  2017-10-24

SQLANYW170000P_4-71001031.ZIP   SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL4 Build 1358    
4   1358    ebf25692    0   306551 KB   2017-10-24  2017-10-24

SQLANYW170000P_3-71001031.ZIP   SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL3 Build 1328    
3   1328    ebf25687    0   306526 KB   2017-10-24  2017-10-24

SQLANYW170000P_1-71001031.ZIP   SQL Anywhere 17.0 SP0 PL1 Build 1211    
1   1211    ebf25157    0   303737 KB   2017-10-24  2017-10-24

[VolkerBarth]

Well, the ZIP files themselves do not show the minor version but AFAIK the contained exe files do, such as

• SA1704_Windows_2100_EBF.exe (for PL12, so it's 17.0.4)
• SA1708_Windows_4148_EBF.exe (for PL28, so it's 17.0.8)
• SA17010_Windows_5745_EBF.exe (for PL41, so it's 17.0.10)

[timcheshire]

Hi Volker, that's what I did. Downloaded them all and checked the exe name.

[VolkerBarth]

FWIW, for newer v17 EBFs/PLs (starting around 17.0.9), here's a self-maintained overview:

• Readme short-cut page / Latest EBFs for v16 / v17

Unfortunately, there's no official documentation/mapping of "minor numbers" to "build number ranges", except a general explanation here.

[Breck_Carter]

> that's what I did

...and thank you for that!

[Breck_Carter]

> the ZIP files themselves do not show

I think that's what TimCH meant by "Launchpad file naming doesn't seem to help" 🙂

[VolkerBarth]

Ah, I thought Tim had got the version information because he installed them all to verify the SQL Central behaviour (quite a time-consuming task...)

It's irritating that the SAP download page does not tell the minor version, nor does the according read me (as that would be available in the donwload page, although behind several links...)

[Breck_Carter]

> to verify the SQL Central behaviour (quite a time-consuming task...)

I am assuming he did verify the behavior: "My tests show that SQL Central is compatible at the minor version level and will not work with a higher version."

[jack_schueler]

There is no time machine built into SQL Central. Unlike some other tools, this one has very intimate knowledge of the workings of the servers that were in place at the time that version of SQL Central was published. It does not know the future. So while a 17.0.n version of SQL Central knows everything about n, n-1, etc., it has no idea what might be changed in n+1, n+2, etc. There's a reason the computer software industry uses the term "backward compatibility" and, not very often, "forward compatibility". The same thing applies to other client software. For example, the 17.0.n ODBC driver might let you use it against a 17.0.n+1 server, but there is no guarantee that you would get 100% correct behaviour (perhaps a new system table was introduced or a new data type). You should always use the latest client software.

[Breck_Carter]

> You should always use the latest client software.

If client software is not included, what is your definition of "backward compatibility"?

[Breck_Carter]

> the 17.0.n ODBC driver might let you use it against a 17.0.n+1 server, but there is no guarantee that you would get 100% correct behaviour

OMG! 🙂

I do not know of ANY installation that forces ODBC driver updates onto client computers every time they upgrade servers to a new build of dbsrv17.exe.

[VolkerBarth]

Jack, the quoted doc in my comment on the question does not mention backward compatility...

In the (probably rare) case a new server feature would require a new SQL Central plug-in, I would expect a readme entry to explain that... (based on my positive experience that SQL Anywhere generally is very well-documented).

I would agree that SQL Central is a particular client app, so there might be more need to keep up with the server version. For regular client apps, I guess it's very common to update them rarely.

[jack_schueler]

Who said "build"? I said version as in 17.0.9 and 17.0.10. Suppose that the server introduced a new datatype called "timestamp with time zone". Would you expect your old ODBC driver to report that as one of the supported data types? Would you expect the old ODBC driver to be able to handle that data type correctly? No one "forces" you to update the ODBC driver, but it would be good to do so. Each time we increment the version number (major or minor part), you could bet that there are some new features in the software.

[jack_schueler]

@Volker I do agree with you there. I think that the statement is a bit "loose" on what a version is. For example, there was a version 12.0.0 and a 12.0.1 and everyone would agree that a similar statement made about "version 12" would have been (or was) wrong. Whoever wrote the article knew about integers (17 > 16 > 12) but didn't know about our "Dewey" decimal number ordering.

Technically, the piece only refers to "databases" not server versions. We all know that a new 17.0.10 database might not run on a 17.0.4 server (have you ever seen the capability message?).

[Breck_Carter]

> Would you expect your old ODBC driver to report that as one of the supported data types? Would you expect the old ODBC driver to be able to handle that data type correctly?

Please stop raising invalid straw man arguments. Nobody would expect, or need, an existing ODBC driver to handle new features introduced inside a DBMS product, nor would they expect, or need, any data traffic using the new features. One of the reasons ODBC exists is to isolate clients from the internal workings of the DBMS.

> No one "forces" you to update the ODBC driver, but it would be good to do so.

No one "forces" me to agree with you, either 🙂

[jack_schueler]

Nobody would expect, or need, an existing SQL Central tool to handle new features introduced inside a DBMS product. SQL Central lets you know up front that it can't deal with the new features of the server.

[timcheshire]

My thoughts here are these are minor version EBFs. Not, for example 17.0 to 17.1. What is so significant that the Admin S/W isn't compatible.

All of the organisations I do work for "package" their desktop installs so to simply say we should upgrade is not a straightforward exercise.

[jack_schueler]

Our minor version EBFs are reflected in a 4-digit build number. For example, 17.0.10.1234, 17.0.10.1235. Any time you see a change in the first 3 numbers, it will mean a new version will some significant changes. In the original post, it indicates that you chose to upgrade to 17.0.10 server software but not upgrade the corresponding client tools. I think the guiding principal for SQL Central is "try to guarantee correct behavior in all situations" and that is something that cannot happen if old versions of SQL Central were allowed to inter-operate with newer versions of database servers (you could imagine all the technical support calls we would be getting from folks asking why something did not work correctly).

[VolkerBarth]

Any time you see a change in the first 3 numbers, it will mean a new version with some significant changes.

For older version (pre V16), this was easily understandable, because there always were a "What's new in ..." doc topic with those changes. However, for v17, there is much less obvious connection between the 17.0.x minor version numbers and the corresponding changes. (AFAIK, sometimes the minor version is increased just because some different SAP software which includes SQL Anywhere has a new version...)

In other words: I would not know from the docs what has been changed between 17.0.6 and 17.0.8, for example, and it would also be difficult to tell from a customer perspective what build belongs to what minor version. And was there ever a 17.0.1 - 17.0.3 or a 17.0.5?)