How is going abapper valuation around the world?

[Former Member]

Sometimes, I'm think about abappers roles, a long time ago developers was restricted just to develop, now in addition to develop in a most of cases performs analyst job, but not valuated as. Do you think the same?

[Former Member]

I'm not generalizing about functionals, I know excellents professionals, and it applies to Abapers too.

I will create a blog,where the main objective sometimes could be polemic, but try to find answers and reasons. And I know we have on our minds lot of unanswered questions like this thread.

[Former Member]

Just today my favourite ABAPer at a customer was not abailable to discuss a security design issue, because they sent him for some process design course for his process (not module...).

You can do a lot in SPRO without having to code it on your own.

In my experience it is semi-experts with functional training who update tables with SE16N and not knowledgable ABAPers who develop well designed business applications.

UI developers are however a special class and hard to find as a guru. It is not easy in WDA either to consider all the security aspects.

There are many aspects to good software development and the modern ABAPer is very underrated IMO.

Those who dont need training because they know the tables are on the other end of the spectrum...

Cheers,

Julius

Edited by: Julius Bussche on Jun 30, 2010 11:39 PM

[former_member186695]

Hi Julius,

I'm curious why Abapers would be updating tables through SE16N, I'm sure data entry operators would be cheaper to hire! All you have to do is give them the right authorization!

I've come across "functional" experts who think 80% of the issues can only be resolved through code modifications and user exits, instead of customizing (SPRO), who wouldn't know how to test the business scenarios for the specifications they put together in the first place nor would they like to give a thought to what the user really want while designing those specifications, instead insist on what they could deliver with their vast (pun intended) knowledge! These individuals also seem to think that all the standard reports delivered cannot fulfill the customers requirement, nor they can develop anything from the various reporting tools provided by SAP! so they need Abapers for the reports ONLY thus required at the realization phase!!! And while working on these reports they would spend 5-10 mins doing the code modifications required, quite hilarious!

Underrated indeed!

This, of course, does not apply to every functional expert out there, so if you are one of the good ones, don't take it personal!

regards,

Asim

[Former Member]

First of all - not all functional people are "bad" at what they do. There are some developers that are horrible at programming. Their programs run badly. They use wrong tables. They send people down the wrong path. They program a user exit with a commit work. They don't think about the functional side of things. Therefor they don't test the applications prior to giving them back to the functional consultants.

I think the two jobs are closely related. A developer should know the functional side. Even if they do not get paid for it. They get paid for coding well. I don't think you can code well without knowing something about the functional side of things. Knowing and understanding SPRO is not a big deal. All SPRO is - in my mind - is tables that are used to send programs / code down various different paths. In fact I've designed some tables like that myself. They could be called "custom configuration tables". That way my functional person can change the custom table instead of requesting a code change.

I believe the functional person should know something about coding. They should be able to point the developer in the correct direction. They should know SPRO. What they can do via configuration and wht they need custom development for. HOWEVER, the greatest strength of a functional person is the ability to map out a business process. I believe the new term is business process expert. There was a nice [blog|http://www.sdn.sap.com/irj/scn/weblogs?blog=/pub/wlg/19806] [original link is broken] [original link is broken] [original link is broken]; about it. There are so many things that they do besides configuration.

What about the BASIS person? There was a [blog |http://forums.sdn.sap.com/post!reply.jspa?messageID=9269687]about that recently too. Do you see an overlap of job functions?

I think our jobs are like SAP itself. Interrelated.

Pay differences. I guess my feelings are you are paid what you are worth. Supply and demand dictate who gets paid the most. Evidently the functional people are in less supply and more demand. However, I would guess that the developers that know something like WDA are getting paid very well right now.

I worked as a business analyst for a while. (Functional side). I didn't like it - some of it was fun, but... I would rather get down and dirty with the code. So I guess I decided my job path was not what paid the most. It was what I enjoyed doing. I've thought about going back to the business analyst side of things. But I would miss out on all the new technology.

So ABBAPER valuation? The value is what you are worth in your own mind. Are you less important than the functional guy? No. You just do a different job. Are the people on the line less important than you? Get real, they are the reason why you have a job. So shouldn't they get paid more?

I know, I know, long response. I guess I just feel like there is a lot of overlap between the functional and developer job. And really, our life as a developer would not be any fun at all if we were told to just follow the specification.

Underrated? Well I guess we have to deal with that sometimes. It's hard. And I rant about it. But at the end of the day, all I can do is try to change the perception. Some days it's not worth it. Some days you'd be surprised at how much people think you are worth.

This is a great thread. Try turning it into a blog. I bet people would respond there as well. It would also get more visibility.

[former_member186695]

I totally agree that there are good and bad guys/gals on all sides, whether they are functionals, abapers, basis folks, project managers or customers.

To sum it up, they should all know something about what the other guys' responsibilities are. Work hand-in-hand and DO NOT undermine the others worth and contributions toward the project!

Great thread!

Regards,

Asim

[Former Member]

Yes. I think the ABAPPER role is changing. And I put a blog that ranted about it. It's nice to know that people other than me feel that it should change. ( /people/michelle.crapo2/blog/2009/08/26/just-a-developer )

Sometimes I'm expected to just code exactly as the specifications are written. Sometimes I need to understand and know the tables. I need to be able to conduct a meeting. Gather requirements. And at times do configuration.

I think that it just depends on what you like to do. Some companies do have JUST developers. Some developers would rather have the business knowledge as well as the technical knowledge. (Like me). And some companies like mine - have both just ABAPPERs and ABAPPERs who also know the business side of things.

Michelle

[Former Member]

Hi Michelle.

Firstly great blog.

I like to do both roles. But I'm paid to code, and functionals are well paid, sometimes their rates is double then our. Is it fair?

How many times did you have to reject a spec because hasn't a good content? How many times did you have to debug a standard transaction to find an error, and instead of Abap error, the problem is an unassigned checkbox in SPRO? Again, is it fair?

Edited by: Rodrigo Petrone on Jun 30, 2010 6:45 PM

[former_member186695]

@ Michelle Crapo: Very nice blog! Speaks my mind

A developer, in general, who doesn't know the bigger picture (scope of the project at a high level) just cannot get close to delivering a solution! He/she could code it but it's just not the same, no matter how creative, talented and skilled he/she is! Sometimes the developer doesn't want to know what's going on and that's a shame!

There are times when you would just go in and fix an issue without wanting to know what the hell the whole thing is about (you have to know your stuff really well to be able to pull that off) but when you are actually part of a project, I would definitely want to know what's going on overall, specially with the part I am eventually responsible to deliver!

I'm least satisfied when I'm asked to deliver a solution working in a box, cut off from rest of the project, waiting and solely dependent on the specifications delivered by a "functional" or getting information on need-to-know basis even from the manager! It just plainly stinks!!

All the "good" abapers as well as functionals are the ones who work hand-in-hand from the day 1 of the project but sadly it is not always the case! You have to speak your mind now-and-then to let everyone know that you are NOT a coder!

Regards,

Asim